289: Pursuing Big Dreams and Staying Grounded: Kelly Hiller on the Search for Amelia Earhart’s Plane

[00:00:00] Kelly Hiller: They rely on me a lot and I worry about them. You know, is mom being selfish? Is she putting her job first? But on the flip side of that argument, I want them to go after big things too. Like I want them to be inspired to pursue their dreams, to make those types of choices so that the end goals, like you always wanna look back and kind of minimize regrets.

[00:00:20] Kelly Hiller: And I really feel like this is an opportunity. If I'm not there, if I'm not guiding it, that I will regret it.

[00:00:27] Tiffany Sauder: I'm Tiffany Sauder, entrepreneur, wife, mom to four girls and a woman figuring it out just like you. If you're tired of living a life of have to and finally ready to build a life of want to, then you're in the right place.

[00:00:39] Tiffany Sauder: Come on, let's go build your Life of And.

[00:00:51] Tiffany Sauder: We have a very special episode today for you. A couple of weeks ago we sent an email out to our newsletter list and I just told Sam we were working on content for the coming quarter and I was like, I think it would just be super cool if someone had a problem and we just solved it live. Let's do that.

[00:01:08] Tiffany Sauder: Let's show the Life of And toolbox in the wild and let's like, let's see if anybody responds. And so amazing. I'm always surprised when people reply and like we had a bunch of answers or responses to it and one stood out to me that I was like, we have got to jump on the microphone and we have to share how Kelly's gonna be solving this.

[00:01:29] Tiffany Sauder: So Kelly Hiller, the chief marketing officer of Purdue University, reached out. She's got a gigantic job. So many things going on with the most special opportunity for her to sort of step in and do something very unique with her career. I will let her explain that, but I want to share a quote from her response to us, because I think while her.

[00:01:53] Tiffany Sauder: Situation is likely one that no one on planet Earth will ever get a chance to see this exact situation. It is wildly cool. I think these words that she wrote in is a universal conflict for those of us who are working women who have this vibrant heart and this compelling nature to also be so present for the people that we love and that trust us with their childhoods, our kids and our husbands.

[00:02:20] Tiffany Sauder: And so these are the words that she said. She said, I'm caught between my excitement for the adventure and guilt about prioritizing my personal ambitions over my family responsibilities. I'd like coaching a conversation on how to work through this internal conflict between pursuing meaningful opportunities and maintaining my commitment to my family.

[00:02:41] Tiffany Sauder: This balancing act, this intersection of these two things is where all the conflict comes because at first we're like all my word, I can only have one. So this is gonna be truly about solving for your, and Kelly, welcome to the podcast. Thank you for being so brave. Thanks for being here. Thank you for having me.

[00:02:58] Tiffany Sauder: I appreciate it. Okay, so let's start. Why don't you orient. Listeners to what the opportunity is. Mm-hmm. And then just a little lay of the land on your kids' ages, how long you've been married, that kind of thing.

[00:03:13] Kelly Hiller: Sure. So coming up in November, we are gonna have the opportunity to go on an expedition. Um, Purdue University is partnering with a LI on what we believe is Amelia Earharts' claim.

[00:03:26] Kelly Hiller: And our interest in this as, as she's a fellow boilermaker, is to hopefully identify the plane and then a second expedition will happen in early 2026 with the intent to bring the plane back to Purdue University for all to see. So that is the long-term goal. And this has all come about, you know, we've been talking about it since February.

[00:03:46] Kelly Hiller: Verifying whether or not we feel like the evidence is solid. And this is one where we, where we do so we'll, we'll know for sure when the crew gets there, whether or not it's her plane. But this is a huge moment for Purdue University and I didn't think we. We realized the magnitude of the moment. Um, when we made the announcement about the expedition and the, and the evidence of the plane, it was the largest earned media day in Purdue University's history.

[00:04:12] Kelly Hiller: And so that was a real wake up call of this is gonna take a lot. Um, all eyes are gonna be on us and we have this saying in our department is we play varsity, so we are gonna bring our best to the situation and it's gonna be a big moment for the Purdue brand. So what does that entail? And we've been, and we've been shaping that up.

[00:04:30] Kelly Hiller: And obviously in my role, I take that charge professionally and personally to be that protector positioner. Promoter, all the things of the Purdue University brand. And initially at one point during the conversation it was maybe, maybe I was gonna be on the boat, which was a whole different level of inside excitement and terror.

[00:04:51] Kelly Hiller: That has since evolved a couple of times. And now it looks like I'm gonna be based out of Honolulu. Obviously now, like no safety concerns. All those types of things are not now a non-issue, but it's still a huge time commitment and we are shaping up the schedule. It looks like myself and a couple others will be heading out likely November 3rd around there.

[00:05:14] Kelly Hiller: And then depending on the identification, we could be gone. As long as November 16th or so through the early the week of Thanksgiving. Um, just depending on if it is the plane or it's not the plane, what next steps would be. And so that is the longest I've ever been gone for a work trip. I've, whenever I go, the longest I have been gone to this point is a week.

[00:05:37] Kelly Hiller: I still feel guilt over that and usually I'm in a pretty good location, which even makes it worse when you're like, yeah, you're working and you're in Honolulu. That's a really rough day that you're having there. But the objective of that from a business perspective is that in Honolulu, we will be a day behind the crew.

[00:05:56] Kelly Hiller: But we will be up at the same time. So we can be in conversation. We're gonna have a cinematographer on the crew that I'll need to be coaching of what assets we need, what different things. And we are partnering with NBC on this to be as an exclusive arrangement. And so making sure we're getting what they need, getting the clips they need, and then obviously transferring assets back and forth.

[00:06:17] Kelly Hiller: So, um, I'll have busy days, but it's still, it's time away. And how do you, it's that internal struggle of, am I being selfish, but I feel like I am responsible for how Purdue is portrayed in this moment. But then also making sure the systems. Are all in place so that when I'm gone minimizing as much as I can, the inconvenience and those types of things, that, that go along with it.

[00:06:42] Kelly Hiller: So I think, you know, that was one of the reasons I reached out, is I've always struggled with work, travel, and you know, as a mom, you're, you are kind of the heartbeat of the house, of everything, all the little things that come up particularly sure with girls. And that's who in our, is in our house right now.

[00:06:56] Kelly Hiller: So we have four children total ranging in ages from, my youngest is 13, my oldest is 24, my 24-year-old, very independent and is married now and, and living his life. So he's not as much of a concern. My second son is, uh, a junior at Purdue studying civil engineering. And then my girls, I have a senior who's 17 and a sixth grader who's 13.

[00:07:19] Kelly Hiller: And you know, they rely on me a lot and wanna make sure that they, I worry about them, you know, is mom being selfish? Is she putting her job first? But on the flip side of that argument. I want them to go after big things too. Like I want them to be inspired to pursue their dreams, to take some risks, to make those types of choices.

[00:07:40] Kelly Hiller: So that, you know, like me in your career, in your personal life, the end goal is like, you always wanna look back and kind of minimize regrets. And I really feel like this is an opportunity. If I'm not there, if I'm not guiding it, then I will regret it. So keeping all of those things in balance, and like you said, I am married, we've been married over 20 years, so I have a lot of history together.

[00:08:01] Kelly Hiller: Um, but it, it never is easy, you know, when you take kinda yourself out of the mix. And this is also a challenge because the time difference, you know, I'm not gonna be readily available, which I think a lot of times now you can solve or give advice or hey, do this over text and that just won't sync up as cleanly as maybe it has during past travel experiences.

[00:08:22] Kelly Hiller: What's the time

[00:08:23] Tiffany Sauder: difference? It's like eight hours or something while, mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's right around eight. And you will be, I'm so bad at time zones. You'll be behind. Yes. You'll be behind. I'll be behind. Yeah. Yeah. Let's start with like, I made kind of a sheet for myself of like, how are you feeling about, and we're gonna kind of take each one individually.

[00:08:44] Tiffany Sauder: So you mentioned one piece is like leaving my husband. Mm-hmm. Like with all the things to do. So just give me a few sentences on like, Hey, here's how I'm feeling about this. If you were just like, scratching in a journal, here's how I'm feeling about this. Well, right

[00:08:56] Kelly Hiller: now I'm avoiding the conversation. Okay.

[00:08:59] Kelly Hiller: I went to him initially when I knew this was a likely gonna happen and was thinking, Hey, this is on the horizon. Tell me how you feel about it. I feel like we've always had the type of relationship we have. Like he never tells me no. Um, so that isn't a concern, but he's not excited about it either. 'cause he knows the, it's all gonna be on him.

[00:09:20] Kelly Hiller: It's gonna be on him to make, to make all the calls when the kids need this or want that, or. Wanna go someplace or have somebody over, like all of those things. And in the midst of that, in his defense, like he is navigating an an aging parent situation right now, that requires a lot of his time, a lot of his attention, I would say most of all his emotional energy.

[00:09:40] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm. And making sure his mom has, is cared for. And when things come up that he's there to help and assist, which is obviously very, very important to him as well. And our family overall. But where I feel like when I say I am avoiding the conversation is I haven't committed to saying, which I technically don't know yet, but I have a pretty close of like, here's when I'm leaving, here's when I could be coming back.

[00:10:04] Kelly Hiller: Here was when I might be coming back. Um. Just kind of mapping it out. 'cause it's, it's not that I feel like he's gonna be mad, I just know it's this heaviness that I'm gonna put on him that I do feel guilty about knowing everything that he is charged with taking care of right now. Do you know,

[00:10:23] Tiffany Sauder: maybe we'll just take these, uh, what is the easiest for him that you will put on him and what is the hardest, like of the things it's like, hey, these are the, this is the offboarding mm-hmm.

[00:10:36] Tiffany Sauder: Of Kelly's responsibilities to husband. Um, one of the pieces is that he doesn't have the capacity. You are two people doing two jobs right now. Right. And one of you does not have the capacity to do all of the other ones.

[00:10:46] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm.

[00:10:47] Tiffany Sauder: Would there be an opportunity to almost like, make an inventory of these are the things that Kelly is moving over to husband mm-hmm.

[00:10:55] Tiffany Sauder: And which of those can be outsourced, paused somebody else in the house can take on so that it isn't this like obtuse. Lee shaped thing that it's just like, Hey, best of luck. I'll be praying for you. Is there an opportunity to do that?

[00:11:14] Kelly Hiller: I think so, yes. I mean, we are very fortunate and we have a very strong family network around us.

[00:11:19] Kelly Hiller: Um, my parents live in the same town, are very involved in our kids' lives. His dad and stepmom are around, so we have, when I think about like logistical challenges, I feel like those are all extremely easy solves. So I think we can take that. I think what is more on him is, first of all, I don't know what it's like in your house, but the morning routine and getting the hair done.

[00:11:41] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. Um, hair is a thing. And so that is a, particularly with my younger daughter, so I, I, that's a space where I'm gonna need my, I think there's a, a healthy level of, um, encouraging self-sufficiency here. Mm-hmm. Maybe a little bit more that should occur, but my older daughter is also just gonna have to step.

[00:11:58] Kelly Hiller: Up in that space and help her sister out. And then I think it, for me, for the girls particularly, it's that, uh, I fulfill a big, like emotional support angle of listening to the vent guiding. I would say I, I am stronger in that space than he is. He had a brother. So experiencing girls is, is, is very different for him sometimes, particularly in the teenage years.

[00:12:22] Kelly Hiller: So I think that's where I'm gonna have to lean on particularly like my mom and my sister Yeah. To do like, express that, which I've never done before of like, Hey, I need you to check in every couple days and see how things are going, how their days have been, which obviously he will do. But there's just subject matters that I think they feel more comfortable coming to me or, or, or to one of them than they necessarily might him.

[00:12:45] Kelly Hiller: So let's take that actually maybe specifically, '

[00:12:48] Tiffany Sauder: cause let's start with the girls. So I think, can we just like make an inventory? One is hair. Mm-hmm. Right. No, I, I mean literally big and little things. Another is emotional support. Mm-hmm. What are the girls' names? Grace and Lucy. Okay. Emotional support for Grace and emotional support for Lucy.

[00:13:06] Tiffany Sauder: I don't know if your girls like mine, but they, it looks very different for them. My two, like my teenagers, it's like what one needs is very different. So emotional support for grace and emotional support for Lucy. What else? With girls, with the kids,

[00:13:20] Kelly Hiller: I think it's probably really looking ahead proactively of like what events are coming up that we need to be mindful of.

[00:13:28] Kelly Hiller: Is there a dance during this time? What does that look like? Do we anticipate any dress up days at school that we're going to maybe need some supplies for? I will miss the beginning of my daughter's basketball season. Like I think it's maybe four or five games. And, and she's a senior, so that's a big deal.

[00:13:46] Kelly Hiller: And I keep books. So she's very used to me being on the sidelines and a part of that experience. And, and that also is something, you know, Brad will need to help out with is taking that responsibility for the team while I'm gone. But making sure, do you have everything you need for the start of the season?

[00:14:03] Kelly Hiller: Are we good to go there? So I think it's definitely zeroing in on activities and just what things do we anticipate coming up in the calendar during this time period.

[00:14:15] Tiffany Sauder: Is there additional financial, like, are you getting more money for doing this, Kelly? Or is this just like part of your job? No, part of my job.

[00:14:22] Tiffany Sauder: Part of your job, okay. Yeah, I was just, my, my question was around are there financial resources that you guys could say, Hey, as a family we're gonna allocate some of what you're getting to go do this towards like other help. So if we look at. So hair, you said for hair one option is that her older sister does it, right?

[00:14:41] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm.

[00:14:42] Tiffany Sauder: Yeah. Or that she learns how to do it on her own, right? Yeah. Mm-hmm. That would be another option. What other option could we

[00:14:49] Kelly Hiller: have? I guess one other option could be, so my niece is, uh, a cosmetologist and works as a hairdresser, is kind of taking Lucy over to their house one day and being like, Hey, can you give her a tutorial on how to do some things by herself?

[00:15:01] Kelly Hiller: What are some like three or four easy hairstyles that she could manage herself and kind of walk her through that? Mm-hmm. I think she would probably have the more patience and expertise in that area than I do. 'cause when I'm doing it, like, like I'm in a hurry. I am, we let get, we need to get this done.

[00:15:18] Kelly Hiller: What are you wanting today? And get you out of the house.

[00:15:22] Tiffany Sauder: Yeah. I think one of the things I would be thinking about, 'cause I leave too, is you don't want it to be this cliff where everything feels different when you leave. That like, that's a really good point. Everything. Everything is as it was until the day mom left and then a hundred percent of things are changing on that day.

[00:15:37] Tiffany Sauder: Yeah. So staging this, 'cause you have five, maybe six weeks until you leave. Mm-hmm. To start looking at, hey, we're gonna incorporate some of these changes. Some of these are things, like you said, it's your daughter's hair that need to happen anyway. And separating that for your girls of like, these are not all mama's leaving and so everybody's lives have to change.

[00:15:56] Tiffany Sauder: Some of this is me saying, Hey, this is something I want you to learn how to do so that your 15-year-old self will only know how to do it if your 13-year-old self starts to practice it kind of thing. Or

[00:16:06] Kelly Hiller: no, that's a really good point.

[00:16:07] Tiffany Sauder: 11. I haven't thought about it from that perspective. So I would like literally have a list like this and say, girls, these are the things I'm looking ahead that are gonna change when mom.

[00:16:18] Tiffany Sauder: Goes on this trip. Have you told them yet? I know that that was,

[00:16:21] Kelly Hiller: so my older daughter overheard a conversation. Okay. So she's aware that I likely could be leaving. My youngest is, has no idea. And so I, I, she will, she is the one that will emotionally struggle the most. And she's a COVID kid. So, you know, when she started school, she was at home and still is very, she likes that attention.

[00:16:43] Kelly Hiller: She is very dependent on me, and so she's the one I think will emotionally struggle the most when I'm gone. I expect tears, uh, on occasion for sure. But again, I think the flip side of this too is learning to cope, learning to kind of push yourself and see what, what you're capable of, what you can, what you can get through.

[00:17:05] Kelly Hiller: Obviously, like I wanna put support in there for her, but I do see this as a little bit of a growth opportunity. Who else is she really connected to? My mom. Yeah. Her nana. They are tight. They're very, very tight. And so she goes there every day after school until I wrap up meetings or un unless she has a practice sometimes.

[00:17:27] Kelly Hiller: 'cause my, my parents live right at the end of the street where the high school and is at. So they're never allowed to move. We've talked about that. Yeah. Until my kids graduate. 'cause it's so convenient. So my mom, she will still see her every day and that's huge. You know, my parents aren't traveling. That actually would've been a factor in my decision if my parents had been traveling during this time.

[00:17:49] Kelly Hiller: Um, which thank goodness they're not. 'cause Lucy will definitely, she will need her nana, there's no doubt about it. So

[00:17:56] Tiffany Sauder: I think on the emotional support side again, so that not everything, just like clips is like maybe on, I don't know, Tuesdays and Thursdays. Your mom brings Lucy as your younger one. Mm-hmm.

[00:18:07] Tiffany Sauder: Brings her home and makes dinner. Cleans up the kitchen for your husband, like, you know, like, just sort of like does the thing. That's a fantastic idea.

[00:18:17] Kelly Hiller: Yeah.

[00:18:17] Tiffany Sauder: And it brings her, her, 'cause my mom is the same way in, in it is your, it feels like you, when it's your mom. 'cause the home you created is so close to the one you grew up in.

[00:18:28] Tiffany Sauder: And so there's like this incredibly amazing thing that happens when your kids are close to your, the maternal grandma. So how do you bring her in and maybe even a week or two before you leave, there's one day where she comes and does that while you're home. So that a, she kind of sees the rhythm of what it looks like where you put things, where the bag gets hung.

[00:18:50] Tiffany Sauder: Like, so there's not all these visual cues that mom's gone.

[00:18:54] Kelly Hiller: No, I think that would be really helpful. And I think it'd also be helpful for my husband. 'cause that's, that's a heavy lift. Um, oh, you know, dinner every night with no. With no break particularly, you know, on the days that he, he does, he, he, he doesn't travel necessarily far, like he's within driving distance.

[00:19:11] Kelly Hiller: But there are days where like he has to go to locations in Illinois. So he just comes in a little bit later and sometimes he needs to stop and take care of some things for his mom. So kind of thinking through what days do you anticipate your longer days to be and trying to line it up with that, with her coming in and, you know, bringing Lucy home and kind of getting some things prepped would be extremely helpful.

[00:19:34] Tiffany Sauder: Yeah. So if you think about, there's five nights in a weekday, which is really when, or in a Yeah, in the, there's five nights in the work week.

[00:19:42] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm.

[00:19:43] Tiffany Sauder: I feel like Friday night is the easiest of the five for sure. So then you're down to four. So this is how I would think about it. If I was prepping JR. I'd say, okay, two of them, my mom is gonna come take care of one of them.

[00:19:55] Tiffany Sauder: You're gonna get take out. And one of them, I have dinner in the freezer for you. So there's only three or four meals you need to kind of get prep before you leave because the whole week your brain will die. Yeah. Or the whole, you know, in 21 days your brain will die. Right. You don't have time to do that.

[00:20:08] Tiffany Sauder: Right. So maybe you go get some like frozen things at GFS and you tell your mom, Hey, you're gonna come Tuesday and Thursday, Tuesday before you leave, I want you to put this in the fridge so that it's thawed. Mm-hmm. And then on Wednesday night, your husband just has to put that in the oven. And on Monday nights he always gets carryout from Chipotle or wherever it is, you know?

[00:20:27] Tiffany Sauder: Sure. No, that would be very helpful. Hadn't even thought about frozen meals. That would be huge. So then it's like he doesn't have to solve for what's happening. It's on the fridge. Your mom is essentially prepping the next day's food. Mm-hmm. Like, hey, can you prep that for him? Cutting some lettuce if it's enchiladas or whatever the things Mom can, moms can do that no fast, super fast.

[00:20:45] Tiffany Sauder: Grandmas can do that very fast. They can, yes. So then all he has to do is administer it. There's not decisions for him to make in it. Mm-hmm. And at least for my husband, that would make that automatic. So it's like, how do I use my people? How do I use my resources and how do I make this so that it's clear and nobody has decisions that need to be made?

[00:21:02] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. I think that would be a big one for him is that decision fatigue. Oh. Of just being the constant go-to that needs to make the call, whether it's what we're having for dinner or can Grace's boyfriend come over? Like all those things that those, when you work, I'm sure you feel like when you work all day, there's a, there's just this limit you reach of where like, I don't care how large or small it is, I do not wanna make one more decision today.

[00:21:25] Tiffany Sauder: Yeah. So maybe you guys decide what categories of those questions need to go to your husband and what categories of those goes to nana. I

[00:21:35] Kelly Hiller: think that would be helpful. And communicating that to both of them. Um, ev the whole family needs to sit down so everybody's on the same page. Yeah. I

[00:21:43] Tiffany Sauder: think making it, that

[00:21:43] Kelly Hiller: would be

[00:21:43] Tiffany Sauder: extremely helpful.

[00:21:44] Tiffany Sauder: Making it very explicit and say like, okay, whether or not your boyfriend can come over is a grandma question, but here's our family ground rules with that. Yeah. Is the adult adult gonna be home? Whatever the things are. Mm-hmm. So that she's not put in a situation, you know what I mean? Or it's like, can't be more than three hours or after 10:00 PM whatever the things are.

[00:22:04] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm.

[00:22:04] Tiffany Sauder: Everybody knows, everybody knows the rules and this is how this is gonna work and who it's gonna go to. 'cause it's so much, there's no way, even if it was the mom who was staying home, not the dad, it's too much to do it all on your own for this long. Yeah. So I would be, 'cause some of the things we wrote down, like scheduling special needs that come up, emergency school, like, yeah, today's jog-a-thon, you know, kill me off.

[00:22:27] Tiffany Sauder: Those kinds of things. You're gonna be behind, but you still will get the school emails. So if, if you have a master, I would have a master plan for when I was gonna be gone that everybody can see and that we have a massive family meeting before we, like a week before I leave that says I need to make sure everybody understands what's happening and where have we left some gray area.

[00:22:51] Tiffany Sauder: And then that's what gets updated. So

[00:22:53] Kelly Hiller: mm-hmm.

[00:22:54] Tiffany Sauder: When you get a school email about a new thing, you can tell your mom, I've put it in green on the master calendar so you can see it was added. I need you to go to Target and pick up three green envelopes. Never the silly obscure requests are, but you'll still have Amazon on your phone.

[00:23:12] Tiffany Sauder: You'll still have for sure, Instacart. There'll still be things that like you can administer from where you are. So some things to think. The other thing that I would think about is, is, is there a way that your mom could be added while you're away to school or team emails?

[00:23:26] Kelly Hiller: So the nice thing is she also substitute teaches.

[00:23:29] Kelly Hiller: Ah, so she gets all the school emails. So that's an easy check. But I hadn't thought about, particularly with Grace's basketball season starting, I could easily add her to the team Sports U. So she's getting those updates.

[00:23:42] Tiffany Sauder: Yes. I think that could certainly help. The other thing I thought about when I'm in my first high school volleyball season this year.

[00:23:49] Tiffany Sauder: And so I am learning the types of requests that come from a mom. And I'm like, I can tell in the team there are, some moms have more time than money and there are some moms that have more money than time. We need to let people bifurcate into the column that they would like to be in. So you may go to a friend and say, can I give you 400 bucks to sign up on my behalf to take care of these two meals that I'm supposed to do this season?

[00:24:15] Tiffany Sauder: 'cause I'm gonna be gone this excursion. You know what I mean? Mm-hmm. And can you just remove the stress for me? I I, would you have the time and the heart for it? Can you just take our volunteer and let the coach know this is what we're doing? May be a way to kind of park some of that too.

[00:24:30] Kelly Hiller: No, I think I definitely need to think about that because at least the nice thing in, in my situation is that because I'm a senior mom, we will, and I have one other, another senior mom, we will like be in charge of those signups.

[00:24:42] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm. So making like, I need to make that a priority mid-October by the, when the team starts practicing to get that signup out and push my obligations to when I will be back. Mm-hmm. And not while I'm gone and make sure I get those slots filled.

[00:24:57] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. Totally. Do you have an assistant at work? Mm-hmm.

[00:25:01] Tiffany Sauder: Yes. Could she do some of that for you? She could, yeah. You might think about that.

[00:25:07] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. And I think too, and having assistant honestly is something that's new to me. I'm just about, oh goodness, we've been together, uh, we're about 18 months and so I'm, you know, I've just always been wired to figure everything out myself.

[00:25:21] Kelly Hiller: So learning to leverage her and I feel like I've made really good strides in that area over the past, like, hey. Last week I went to a Chief X event in Chicago and I had some other meetings that morning and I was really, I was thinking about, okay, I need to know like when are my hard stops that I need to be in the car and I need to be driving and asked her to do an agen, like an itinerary for me.

[00:25:40] Kelly Hiller: And it was so incredibly helpful. I'm like, why did I not do this before? Yeah, it's amazing because it was, I, I mean I had it with me all day. I referred to it multiple times and it was so helpful. Amazing. Love that.

[00:25:52] Tiffany Sauder: So do you guys do family meetings as a

[00:25:56] Kelly Hiller: We do. I wouldn't say we're super consistent about it, but it is usually like on, it depends on the week.

[00:26:02] Kelly Hiller: Usually we make it a priority. We try to have family dinner together every night, but with activities like sometimes that just doesn't play out. Um, if anything, it's always, usually my husband and I and Lucy Sure. 'cause Grace, a lot of times we'll have a different, and I have obligation, but we make it a priority.

[00:26:17] Kelly Hiller: Like Sunday night everybody needs to be home and we have try to do dinner and so that's when we usually kind of go over the week and talk about. Anything that we don't know, like especially from the kid's perspective, is there anything that's not on my radar, that's not on the calendar that you know is gonna hit this week and try to get organized?

[00:26:35] Kelly Hiller: So one of the things you might think

[00:26:37] Tiffany Sauder: about is if there's a way to get more disciplined about that going into this experience. Mm-hmm. Just so that, 'cause when you're home and around, there's more that can be left to just like it being intuitive.

[00:26:48] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm.

[00:26:48] Tiffany Sauder: And so just starting to lock in and being thoughtful about like, I need you to take responsibility for this 'cause I'm not gonna be here to catch you and I want you to be able to fail while I'm home.

[00:26:59] Tiffany Sauder: Sure. So that it doesn't feel like it's all changing when you leave. And the other thing I might think about Kelly is how do you, those family dinners or your weekly check-in, is there a way in your schedule that while you're in Hawaii, you can have a couple of those touchpoints with your family? So can you block.

[00:27:20] Tiffany Sauder: Once a week when dinner time is on Eastern Time. Mm-hmm. And you literally sit on Zoom and you, I don't know, you know, you're both, you're eating dinner together. Yeah, that's a really good idea. And once a week we eat dinner together, whatever time that is for you or whatever meal it is. Or on Sunday evenings, we're gonna go through the schedule that's coming up.

[00:27:39] Tiffany Sauder: We're gonna review what went well and went poorly. We're like, you're gonna take an hour and a half and it's gonna be scheduled and you're gonna protect that time and you're gonna let your team know that I need this time with my family and they need it from me. So that, that those connections are scheduled and the kids aren't wondering, when is the next time I'm gonna see mom?

[00:27:58] Tiffany Sauder: It's like they know.

[00:28:00] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. I think that's a really, a really good point, is planning that schedule. 'cause one thing I, I noticed, I was in France for work over the summer and it was hard for me. I didn't do that in advance and it was hard because. You know, I'd get a random FaceTime and I may be in a situation Yeah.

[00:28:16] Kelly Hiller: Or in a moment where I can't, I can't step away. And then I felt guilty. 'cause I know she needs me. I know she wants to talk to me about something and I would say, Hey, gimme 20 minutes and I'll call you right back. But having that preset ahead of time, I think would just help manage availability expectations.

[00:28:33] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm. And those types of things.

[00:28:35] Tiffany Sauder: Yep. And for your girls too, like an eight hour time difference is hard to kind of conceptualize and some of them kind of knowing I can't do it in my brain quickly, when in the day you might have more like sort of real time texting availability mm-hmm. Versus it just being really different.

[00:28:53] Tiffany Sauder: So that's something to think about is how do you schedule, be as intentional with those check-ins when you're away as when you're home so that that feels kind of grounding to them.

[00:29:03] Kelly Hiller: That's a, a good idea. And it's. Um, I actually last week set up on my phone, like in my world clock, like, what is the time in Honolulu?

[00:29:11] Kelly Hiller: What is the time in Marro, where the crew is gonna be, and where's the time here? So I could easily too go in their phones and set up their world clocks so they can look at that at any time and know what time, what time is it for mom?

[00:29:23] Tiffany Sauder: Yes. Yes. That would be very empowering, especially to your sixth grader for sure.

[00:29:28] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. I think my other question is like, what's, what's the best thing that could happen coming out of this? Hmm.

[00:29:34] Kelly Hiller: Well, I, I guess from a family lens, I do think creating. Like I said, self-sufficiency and overall my oldest grace is, is pretty self-sufficient, but there's always room to improve. And I, I don't know, kind of as you're thinking about meals, I kind of like to see if I could put that on her one day a week.

[00:29:54] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm. Um, just because like she's gonna be going to college next year. Yeah. And I think that that's a regret I have with my son is that I didn't push that more when he was home. Like we made sure to, like he knew how to do his laundry and all that stuff, but I feel like cooking is an area I could have done a better job with him.

[00:30:08] Kelly Hiller: And so I think this could be a good opportunity for her to own that responsibility. Um, like this night it's yours and assigning that, even if it's something frozen. But just the simple, like being able to, you know, make sure the table is set, make sure you know the. Temperature is right. All those types of things that you're paying attention to, it could be really helpful for her.

[00:30:28] Kelly Hiller: So I think there is a level of self-sufficiency, I'm gonna use your phrase, like that's a values-driven perspective. I think when, like an ego-driven perspective, I hope they see that like mom was a part of something that was historically significant. Mm-hmm. And that's really freaking cool. Like I do wanna have their admiration from that.

[00:30:47] Kelly Hiller: I don't want them to feel like this was overall a giant inconvenience. You know? I always want them to be proud of me and, and the work that I do and, and see value in that. Mm-hmm. Yep. What about for you? I think kind of when I, as we've talked through this, I think there's a lot of opportunities for me to be just a, a better partner to my husband and him to see that.

[00:31:12] Kelly Hiller: And I think then he feels kind of more seen and heard that I do recognize. This is hard for him and that a lot's gonna be on his plate. So I think there's a real, 'cause now when I just kind of talking through this, even when I've traveled before and the trips haven't been as long, there's a lot that I could have done from a support perspective to minimize his stress and just be like ICUI.

[00:31:37] Kelly Hiller: I more recognize how tough this is and an aspect of this too that I, that I wanna be very sensitive with him about. And is that I think the other two individuals going with me are just in different life stages. One has an infant, one is is married, but they don't have children yet. So I think that their spouses are gonna come for a while, which like.

[00:31:59] Kelly Hiller: That's fine, but like we, that would just be too hard for us to do. Mm-hmm. With everything going on. So I think that's also gonna be a little bit hard for him to stomach is like everybody else has their families there and, and you don't and I'm not a part of that. Mm-hmm. Which will be hard for me too.

[00:32:14] Kelly Hiller: Like I'm totally gonna be the third wheel, um, at some point and this journey and that's okay. Um, because it needs to come for our family. So I think I can demonstrate better support to him as a form of care and love that I maybe haven't done in the past. Would it be possible for your mom

[00:32:30] Tiffany Sauder: to stay with the kids for five days so he could come for a couple days and see this experience with you?

[00:32:36] Kelly Hiller: I think maybe, um, I think there's some variables there in. With his mom, whether or not he would feel comfortable right now leaving. Some other things have to, it just kind of depends where, where we're at with her care at that time, whether or not that's possible. You know, another thing we've talked about is if the plane is found, and I likely won't get back until the beginning of like the week of Thanksgiving and my birthday is the 25th.

[00:33:02] Kelly Hiller: And so we talked about do we, do we just kinda stay there and we do Thanksgiving there. Mm-hmm. And kind of make it a vacation so that everybody can come since the girls will out. So we've talked about that. But I do think once we have dates nailed down and kind of, I feel like I need to map out the schedule and see what's possible.

[00:33:19] Kelly Hiller: But hopefully he could come for a few days. Yeah.

[00:33:22] Tiffany Sauder: I think that could potentially be a very magical conclusion to this, to have them all come out and join you. There is something very intimate about having seen what you saw about having a. Experience some of where you ate and where you slept. Mm-hmm. And so for, this is gonna be a, if they find this, uh, a top five mountaintop moment in your career, likely Oh, for sure.

[00:33:47] Tiffany Sauder: If they find this. And so for your family to feel like they got a chance to see it and participate even in 5% of it with you, I think could be potentially something really special to, and, and it's different if he's like, I don't, I don't feel comfortable leaving because of where my parents' health is at.

[00:34:05] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. Is a different choice that he may choose than, Hey, I feel like I could set this up if you want to come and give him the option. Potentially again, not telling you what to do, but I think, um,

[00:34:18] Kelly Hiller: no, I think that's a really good way to approach it too then. Like he kinda has here, here are some options I've identified that I think are possibilities.

[00:34:25] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. And then give him. The agency to be like, okay, I feel like this feels good to me. This feels like this would work.

[00:34:35] Tiffany Sauder: I wanna take a quick moment to thank my partners at Share Your Genius. For the past four years, they have been an incredible part of my journey. Behind the Microphone, share Your Genius is a content and podcast production agency that helps leaders and brands bring their message to life.

[00:34:49] Tiffany Sauder: So whether you're trying to find your voice, develop a content strategy, or get your leader behind a microphone, they're gonna help you make it simple, strategic and impactful. One of my own mistakes is there was a, a holiday season where my, my husband runs this business. They live in Austin, Texas. The owners do, and the whole executive team, they were flown down with spouses and all this kind of stuff, and I just was like.

[00:35:15] Tiffany Sauder: Yo, it's December. We have That's like between hardest time of the year. Yeah. Four and 5,000 children it feels like. Yeah. You know? And I was just like, there's no way. And I didn't even try. I was just like, there's no way. There's no way. There's no way. A weekend in December. Mm-hmm. And he was so hurt that I did not even try.

[00:35:35] Tiffany Sauder: It felt like logistically just the simplest thing for me to stay back. They're not my people, it's not my company. You know what I mean? I was just like, I don't know. I don't, I'm not saying I didn't wanna hang out with him, but I was just like very dismissive of the whole thing. And if I would've worked my face off and been able to show him this is what I can do, it feels like a little crazy.

[00:35:55] Tiffany Sauder: But I could be there for one night and then this thing or whatever. I think it would've gone long way. I would've just tried. And it was so hurtful to him, and I really underestimated how he just needed me to be there.

[00:36:08] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm.

[00:36:09] Tiffany Sauder: And I forget that sometimes he just needs me. To be there. And so just sharing my own mistake as encouragement to just like think about that piece of it too.

[00:36:21] Tiffany Sauder: So.

[00:36:23] Kelly Hiller: Well, and I think, I mean, I bet too it was hard for him. Like you're sitting in that environment and you're looking around and everybody else has their, has their spouses and Yeah. I think I will experience that same feeling and looking around and everybody has their spouses and I'm like, have fun at dinner guys.

[00:36:39] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. Because you'll start to get lonely too. Yeah. Take a walk. I

[00:36:44] Tiffany Sauder: think I will experience those feelings. Yeah. And in some ways, when you're in a beautiful new place, your senses are gonna be at like a 12, like mm-hmm. This, this sunset. I wanna share it with somebody. The sand is so soft. This be, you know, like, and being able to connect your family into that experience with you will also make you feel less alone when you remember this and want to talk about it.

[00:37:08] Tiffany Sauder: And because it's gonna be a keystone moment for you, Kelly.

[00:37:13] Kelly Hiller: Yeah, and I kind of hadn't even thought about it from the perspective of like the aftermath and talking about it. I'm lucky, I've had some really cool experiences. I got to go represent Purdue Global as a part of the Paris Olympics. Um, and so when you come home and you're so jazzed about this experience and what you saw and what you ate, and you kind of get these eyeballs back at you like, well, that was great for you.

[00:37:35] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. I don't know what you're talking about. And you're, you're wanting them to be excited and, and like think that was cool, but they haven't experienced it so. They don't care. And then it's just like, well, that was very anti-climatic. Yeah. Well then you don't feel free to even share your memories with 'em.

[00:37:55] Kelly Hiller: No, no. You don't talk about it. You're just like, oh, I'm home. I'm gonna go unpack now. Totally. Yeah. No, I, yeah, I've had those, definitely had those moments of just feeling like, oh, okay, well it's over. You all don't wanna hear about it, so let's get back to life. Yeah,

[00:38:10] Tiffany Sauder: yeah, totally. And it's like, it's so expanding for everybody's relationships and mm-hmm.

[00:38:16] Tiffany Sauder: Perspectives and worldviews and what's possible to be able to go kind of do it together. So anyway, something to think about. You know, if the expedition doesn't go that long, it might be totally insane to do this, but like, even if you get back on November 16th, it's like, like, dude, we're going to family, we're gonna do Thanksgiving week in Hawaii no matter what.

[00:38:38] Tiffany Sauder: Yeah. We're either all flying back together and I'm showing you where I had PKA dogs and we're the best, you know, whatever it is. And we're gonna do it together. And it's a reward, it's like a celebration that our family got through this together. Mm-hmm. I wanna go show you what I did and what we explored and the food I ate so that you can experience this with me.

[00:38:56] Tiffany Sauder: And it's like I, I have learned there are consequences that my kids, my family has to absorb as a result of me working. Some of those are hard and some of those are incredible and I want, I would want this one to feel incredible. 'cause it, it is incredible. And they're both things. Yeah. They're, you're gonna experience incredible things and hard things.

[00:39:17] Tiffany Sauder: So thinking about how do you give them an incredible, as part of this experience mm-hmm. It could be going back to Hawaii, which I think is very poetic and amazing. I love that version of the story.

[00:39:27] Kelly Hiller: Mm-hmm.

[00:39:28] Tiffany Sauder: But you're like, I'm asking you guys to absorb the difficult consequence of me being away. How do we think about you and your husband or just you about like, how do I also create a moment where it's like, dang, this also doesn't happen without mom.

[00:39:43] Tiffany Sauder: Working Right. And needing to travel sometimes. And so drawing those out well for our kids so that they see, like, 'cause it can kind of be like, well, yeah, we just have more money, you get more stuff. But I try to be very intentional about like, this is an opportunity we have because I've worked outside the home, or because we have two incomes.

[00:40:03] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. Or because of the relationships that I've made so that they see there's some pretty rad things that happen in your life

[00:40:09] Kelly Hiller: also. Um, I, I try to hit that point frequently too good. Of like why things are possible. So I think that's important. But I think what's interesting too is I'm somewhat having this epiphany of like, you know, I talked about.

[00:40:22] Kelly Hiller: Feeling selfish that I'm making this, that, you know, essentially like end the day, it's, it's my call. Like whether I, I go or don't go. I, you know, you have people who contribute, but at some point you have to say, I'm doing this or I'm not doing this. And if I'm saying it, and you know, when I've traveled and now I'm saying I'm doing this, I think part of the reason, like I've been struggling, struggling with feeling selfish is 'cause I haven't invested enough time upfront and putting those systems in place.

[00:40:48] Kelly Hiller: Yep. And putting that extra support in place, you know, scheduling those touch points. I think I've been too focused on, okay, here's the printout of this schedule. This is what I need to pack. Good luck guys. It's gonna be great. Really? When, when really it's gonna be great for me. It's probably not gonna be so great for you.

[00:41:07] Kelly Hiller: And just now just talking through this, like re-imagining the experience more holistically, not just so focused on the, I'm just taking myself out of the equation here.

[00:41:20] Tiffany Sauder: That's exactly right. Kelly. I'm so excited to hear what you heard and looking at what some of these systems can serve us. When I get back home, I was telling one of my girlfriends, I was like, whenever I'm gone in the evening, I love to cook food.

[00:41:31] Tiffany Sauder: I love when our house smells like food. I love to feed my kids good food. It's like one of my love languages. So I have created this irritating habit that my kids like to eat good food when they get home. And so when I'm not home it's like, ugh. You know? And they pa they just, it's like they're not gonna put a hot pocket in the microwave, which is my making.

[00:41:48] Tiffany Sauder: So when in my house it's opposite.

[00:41:49] Kelly Hiller: My husband is the cook

[00:41:51] Tiffany Sauder: and we often

[00:41:52] Kelly Hiller: jo joke that we have made our kids very smelly. Yeah. Like, they like good food. 'cause you, I'll say, you know, if nobody's home make a sandwich or do this and it, they're very much appalled in my suggestions because of that. Hilarious.

[00:42:07] Tiffany Sauder: So I have done things like if I'm gonna be gone, my husband's assistant.

[00:42:11] Tiffany Sauder: Knows three restaurants my family likes food from and the girls' orders. And I will say, can you order this food for JR to pick up on his way home? Oh wow. So that when I'm gone, he doesn't have, and she puts on his calendar pick up food at Stone Creek, you know what I mean? And so it, all I have to do is text her.

[00:42:29] Tiffany Sauder: I'm gonna be gone Tuesday. She picks one of those three restaurants and she already knows the order. So I don't have a bunch of to-dos to do either to be gone. I just have to text her and he doesn't have to chase everybody down for what everybody's eating. And you know what, one time every two months, they don't have to pick what they eat that night.

[00:42:47] Tiffany Sauder: It's something you told me you like from that menu. Right. And so then it just works. And so I'm not like, oh geez, I'm gonna be gone. I have to prep dinner the night before. And it's like, ain't nobody got time for that. So it makes it just a system and it's set up and I just text candy. I'm gonna be gone on Tuesday, pick a dinner, do the thing.

[00:43:03] Tiffany Sauder: She's got the credit card. Just make it happen.

[00:43:06] Kelly Hiller: That is a very solid point as well. My husband has, I, she's lovely, but I don't interact with her hardly ever. Um, and I know she would do anything ever to help our family, so I think she would actually, I think she would enjoy it, you know, oh, candy text me 40 times.

[00:43:20] Kelly Hiller: He picked it up and got it. Did the girls like the food? Like, my God, because they're, they're doing something that like brings your family joy and then that, that brings that person joy in return. So that is a great suggestion.

[00:43:33] Tiffany Sauder: So even having her, I don't know what their interactions are or like if, if your husband and his assistant have like a meeting every single morning when he gets into the office to let her know I'm gonna be gone on these dates.

[00:43:45] Tiffany Sauder: Can you include these three questions? When you guys are doing your download, what can I do for you for the home? Are you clear on what's dinner tonight? And is there anything that the girls need? Oh, my word assistance have, they are the ones who, who have time to be interrupted. It's like their job to do the emergency stuff, right.

[00:44:03] Tiffany Sauder: So that could be a really helpful thing for him too, where he is like, I didn't have time to do this last night. Can you get this thing ordered? Can you go get a gift card for the thing? I mean, that's the stuff all random that just

[00:44:14] Kelly Hiller: murders

[00:44:14] Tiffany Sauder: you.

[00:44:15] Kelly Hiller: It is. 'cause it, it's not on the plan and it has a deadline and so it definitely throws a wrench into things.

[00:44:22] Tiffany Sauder: Or even if you hear something, you include her on the text string to say, Hey, can you take care of this for my husband tomorrow? This needs to be at the high school by this time or the three 50 drop offs at the high school. Mm-hmm. For food before the bus lays. Yes. And they're just like, God bless America.

[00:44:39] Kelly Hiller: That's why my parents can never move. Yeah. Until my children graduate. But his

[00:44:42] Tiffany Sauder: assistant for three weeks could help with things like that too. Yeah, it's

[00:44:46] Kelly Hiller: could dramatic time. And she would love that. I mean, she would love to help us. I mean, she just has such a, a huge heart that she would, she would delight in it.

[00:44:53] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. Totally. So

[00:44:55] Tiffany Sauder: look, you just got another person in your squad while you're gone. I did. I hadn't even thought about that. So yes, that's very helpful. Okay, this is the other place I wanted to go. You are in your own head about like, these are all the things that I see are going to be changed when I like exit the family system.

[00:45:14] Tiffany Sauder: This puzzle piece is going to be missing. Mm-hmm. And these are all the connection points that I see. Would also really encourage you to sit your family down and say, I would like for you to take two days to think through what, here's the things I've already thought about, like that. I'm gonna be listening.

[00:45:32] Tiffany Sauder: What am I missing that you experienced that I don't know that I do? What on this list is not important to you that we can stop or that you're comfortable taking on? And how do, how can we stay connected? 'cause some of it is what you need from them to feel connected as a mom. Mm-hmm. This is still with HoCo season.

[00:45:53] Tiffany Sauder: Right. I'm like, I wanna come take your picture freshman in high school at your friend's house. She's like, there's gonna be a lot of pictures. I was like, I don't think I'm gonna get a unique angle. I wanna go 'cause I wanna see it and I wanna be part of it. Right. Right. It has nothing to do with me getting a special picture of you.

[00:46:10] Tiffany Sauder: Right. I just, not about the picture. Wanna experience your freshman homecoming by coming to the house. So it is for me, not for you honey. And she's like, oh, okay, fine. Mm-hmm. So also thinking through, what do you need from them? Like, Hey, I wanna know, you know, from your senior in high school, when you get home, I want you to tell me on a scale of one to 10 how your day was, or I just like, what's your explicit agreement about how you're gonna feel like connected to them?

[00:46:37] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. Because I, you don't want them to feel like I'm bothering you or whatever the things are. And so just with each person, your husband in your two kids at home in particular. Mm-hmm. How are you gonna stay? Connected and what's kind of your agreement on that so that everybody kind of knows what to expect from each other?

[00:46:56] Tiffany Sauder: So that would be of the list of things, what am I missing? Or what do I do for you that I don't see what on this list you don't care about? We can just stop. It's not a deep, it's not that deep. And how are we gonna stay connected? I would try to get really explicit on those things so that you're not making a bunch of assumptions and running around like crazy solving for things that they just aren't as important to them as what you perceive.

[00:47:18] Tiffany Sauder: Or you miss something that's like, oh geez, that was so easy, I just didn't know it.

[00:47:22] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. I think that will definitely be critical. And I have found too, like I experienced this summer, was it's also frustrating when you don't have that communication plan because there's times they're not available too. So I felt like we were missing each other a lot, and then you start to feel even more disconnected.

[00:47:40] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. When you are missing each other and that's, you know, that's not a pleasant feeling of course.

[00:47:45] Tiffany Sauder: No, for sure. You'll be behind them, so. Mm-hmm. You know, if they, if you're like with my, like junior in high school, I would be like, if you send me a summary before bed, when I wake up in the morning, I'll review it and then after school you can read it and it's like kind of this like almost, I remember when they were little, they would do these like little journals where they would like write something on my bed and then I would write something on their bed.

[00:48:11] Tiffany Sauder: You know, it's like kind of that kind of a thing. Mm-hmm. And my second one has no impulse control. She's super emotional, so she would just send me panic text messages. I know. That's what I would be like, and I would be like, so I'm not the panic, I'm not the panic text message person. Here's who you send those to.

[00:48:27] Tiffany Sauder: You know what I mean? Because I don't wanna live through it and it's not gonna, it's gonna be a delay and I can't be helpful 'cause I'm in a totally different time zone. So just sort of going through those

[00:48:35] Kelly Hiller: things. My oldest needs a panic text message person. A 24-year-old? Well, my older girl. Oh,

[00:48:41] Tiffany Sauder: your older girl.

[00:48:41] Tiffany Sauder: She needs

[00:48:42] Kelly Hiller: a, a panic text message person. But I do think, I need to think of, I mean about my boys because they're very self-sufficient, but there are certain things they do depend on me for like, you know, my oldest right now is, is recently kind of taken, um, a supervisor role at his job. And so there's times where he's like, Hey, can you help?

[00:49:02] Kelly Hiller: How, how should I word this? Or Here's an issue I'm dealing with, with an employee, how would you go about it? Whereas my second son, it, it's more about kind of navigating like college or like, he's gonna be in the thick of internship season. So advising him on like, Hey, can you review this letter? Or those types of things.

[00:49:20] Kelly Hiller: I feel like I'm, I'm more their in-house like professional editor. That's true. But establishing that like, you know, sending that stuff to me over email will likely be easier than doing text messages during this time. So things like that to put in place with them. 'cause I still want them to feel. Cared for and that I'm available and that I'm supporting where they're at in their stage.

[00:49:43] Kelly Hiller: Totally. So

[00:49:43] Tiffany Sauder: the same thing I think applies. Mm-hmm. How maybe at least once a week do you have a schedule check in with them. Yeah. And just say, they'll like, Hey mom, can you or I caught, I, you know, they kind of know to catch you on your way to work or lunch. Mm-hmm. Like, they kind of know that they learned the times.

[00:49:58] Tiffany Sauder: So I'd be like, Hey, well I'm away. We, we'll go back to that version of our relationship when I'm home, but let's schedule it. And then, yeah, I'd prefer emails over text and is it that you'll get to it that night? Is it that you'll need two days? Is it that you have Friday evenings? That's what you're gonna do is kind of catch up on your, so that they kind of know what's the response time?

[00:50:17] Tiffany Sauder: Or have 'em let you know, can you tell me how important this is so that I can respond to it in a way that's helpful to you?

[00:50:24] Kelly Hiller: I think that is, that particularly is telling me how important that is to gauge response time would definitely help me prioritize. Yep. Um, what they need and what they need me to look at.

[00:50:35] Kelly Hiller: So I

[00:50:36] Tiffany Sauder: think Kelly, it's gonna be a piece of how do you protect yourself so that you don't get into the over-functioning version of yourself that will be unsustainable for 21 days. You can do that for like five probably, but 21 is gonna get pretty long. It is. And how do you be peaceful so that you about what's happening at home so that you can be present?

[00:50:56] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. For this? Absolutely. Once in a lifetime like wild experience and your girls especially, but probably all your kids. I just know girls better. They will pair it. Your energy and response to this and you started this whole conversation by saying, we play varsity. Teaching them that this is part of who you are.

[00:51:21] Tiffany Sauder: We play, I play varsity in my work. I wanna play varsity for you as a mom. We are gonna play varsity as a team, our family in this season. And we are capable. I am confident in you guys. And I am gonna work to be the best version of a mom eight hours away. And these are some ideas that I have, and we're gonna work together and we're gonna practice some of these things because that's how you, you get on the varsity court, you practice, you communicate well.

[00:51:46] Tiffany Sauder: We're good teammates, we're clear about what we need from each other. We understand our roles. We have a whole team, we have a, you know, a group of people who are gonna help us through this. We have train, like this is how we're gonna do this. So I want you to still feel like you can feel honest with me. I want you to still feel like all these kinds of things.

[00:52:03] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. And also, this is gonna help us all grow. So I would use something like that. And you guys can do this, you can do this, but also protecting your own energy so that you can be present and not just like so over-functioning version of high achieving woman, which I

[00:52:23] Kelly Hiller: could

[00:52:23] Tiffany Sauder: easily fall

[00:52:23] Kelly Hiller: into. Yes. Oh. But I think too, kind of in what you were saying, it's.

[00:52:29] Kelly Hiller: Also how you, I think, how you were approaching that conversation and demonstrating that to me did give confidence. Excitement where I need to keep that tone and I need to keep that tone and framing in mind. Particularly when I talk to my youngest, when I tell my parents and, and not coming at a place from like, oh, I feel like more reserved.

[00:52:50] Kelly Hiller: That probably communicates the guilt that I feel or the hesitation that I feel because they're gonna mimic my feelings. So if I, if I'm coming at it hesitating or feeling guilty or kind of him hawing around that is not gonna make them feel confident. Good. Any positive feelings whatsoever.

[00:53:10] Tiffany Sauder: Totally. So let's talk about this word guilt real quickly.

[00:53:14] Tiffany Sauder: My definition for the word guilt, my definition for balance is that when your time and money are going towards behavior and activities that totally support your values, who you're becoming. And your priorities, what you seek to do in the world. So when all of your time and money is allocated towards those two things, who you are becoming and what you wanna do in the world, that's a life imbalance.

[00:53:39] Tiffany Sauder: We use the word guilt sometimes when we are doing things in that quadrant of life, but we don't think other people are going to agree with it, or it came in a new package than we were expecting. But real guilt is when we pursue our priorities at the expense of our values.

[00:54:00] Kelly Hiller: That's like, that's real guilt.

[00:54:02] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. No, that make, I mean, that makes total sense because what I'm calling guilt is more maybe as, as I'm more concerned about how I am going to be perceived by making this choice. So

[00:54:15] Tiffany Sauder: what your kids need, your family needs to hear from you. We'll talk about the outside world in a minute, is that my values as a mom have not changed.

[00:54:22] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. To love you unconditionally. To be there to support you in every part of life's journey, to feed clothing and be like whatever the things are, and maybe list some of those things that your kids have come to expect from you, and to say, I'm still gonna deliver those things. The way in which they're gonna happen over the next 21 days are going to be a little bit different than when I'm able to sleep in the same address as you.

[00:54:47] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. But who I am as a mom for you is unchanging. And these are the things that we're gonna put in place as a family, so that to the extent possible, these values feel exactly the same. But the way I am gonna stay connected to you is gonna be in this explicit new way and not coming up and tucking you in before bed.

[00:55:04] Tiffany Sauder: I prefer coming and tucking you into bed. I don't wanna be a mom who's eight hours away for the next 10 years, but for 21 days, our family's gonna go through this incredible experience and experiment you like. It is totally different, but I am unchanging and who I am for you, the way that I do these things are gonna be a little bit different.

[00:55:23] Tiffany Sauder: So it's gonna be hard for all of you. And that doesn't mean that you can't all grow through this and helping the kids. The sooner you can start the conversation, the less shock there will be, and the more you can put some of these things in place. So it starts to be like, okay, your 17-year-old had already made dinner three times by herself before you were gone.

[00:55:44] Tiffany Sauder: It wasn't the first time that she was looking for the measuring cup. And then she starts crying because it's like, if mom were here, she'd show me where they were. It's like, practice the three meals you want her to make so that she's seen it before, or maybe it's the exact same meal three times in a row.

[00:56:00] Tiffany Sauder: And so she gets more confident each time she does it. Mm-hmm. So just being really measured and intentional about those things will help them feel set up for success. And it will, again, I love your, like we play varsity, like you practice plays with the coach with nobody watching. Mm-hmm. So that when the lights go on, you're ready.

[00:56:18] Tiffany Sauder: And so it's like this is our practice time family. This is the get the kinks out time.

[00:56:24] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. It's so ironic that like I live and breathe that, you know, during my work life, but it's, I'm also a little disappointed in myself that that hasn't like transferred over into my personal life because I would totally be thinking about the practice, the big presentation, the run through, totally.

[00:56:43] Kelly Hiller: All that type of stuff, and that it, it, for whatever reason, hasn't translated over.

[00:56:49] Tiffany Sauder: We don't do it. I mean, that's the whole, like, that's where the life of an came from. I was like, I am scaling my business. I'm not scaling my life. I'm making like mm-hmm. Why can I do all of these things in my professional life and all of the things that I'm tripping on in my personal life.

[00:57:05] Tiffany Sauder: I'm not doing anything. I'm not delegating, I'm not organized. There's not systems getting the most important things done. People aren't clear on their roles. We don't have a team meeting. I'm like. Of course everything is on me. Of course I'm mad at everybody. Of course I feel overwhelmed. Course I'm mad at everybody, you know?

[00:57:21] Tiffany Sauder: Of course. Yeah. I feel alone. No, I get it. Mm-hmm. If I ran my team like that at work and they were all accessories to my blazing agenda, I'd be like, they would quit. If my family could quit, they might, you know, not anymore. Yeah. But in that old version of me, 'cause I was like, you know, you turn yourself into a martyr, you feel like everything's on you.

[00:57:43] Tiffany Sauder: It's like, well nobody can help 'cause they don't know what to do.

[00:57:46] Kelly Hiller: So, um, and I think that will be a big opportunity, particularly for my husband. 'cause I think that's probably the one where like getting in sync and setting expectations and talking about what are, you know, what are the minimums that need to happen while I'm gone will I think open up some better communication between us as well.

[00:58:04] Kelly Hiller: One question, because when you live together you think, well, you just know what to do. Like Totally. You just know what happens. But it doesn't always work out that way.

[00:58:12] Tiffany Sauder: No, it doesn't. The other thing I would ask him before you, in this next couple of planning weeks is, what can I protect for you that is important for you to feel grounded during this experience?

[00:58:24] Tiffany Sauder: Is there one night a week that he needs to be able to do a client dinner? Is it that he needs to be able to leave the house every morning at 8:00 AM Is it that he needs to run in the, I, I don't know what his thing is, but what

[00:58:37] Kelly Hiller: he needs to get out the door at a certain time. Um, that's a big one for my husband too.

[00:58:41] Kelly Hiller: Yeah. So I think having that conversation and um, including the girls, this a part of this conversation. Like, this is the time dad needs to be heading out the door. So if there is whatever it might be that you need from him, it needs to occur. And plenty of time before that. Yeah.

[00:58:56] Tiffany Sauder: And maybe you, yeah, I don't know.

[00:58:58] Tiffany Sauder: Yeah, so that would be, 'cause my husband has very few things he asks for, but the things he asks for when I manage to them, he's very, he feels very respected by that. And I understand. Right, versus just like expecting him to be absorbed by the, the monster that is a house of four girls and 'cause he's, yeah, he's very punctual.

[00:59:19] Tiffany Sauder: He hates to feel behind. He's very prepared. My husband and I'm more like, I can go wing it a little and like kind of get there and he's not a wing it kind of a person, so I would be like, I mean, I don't know, you can drive a little faster and he just makes him mad. You know, your hus help help your husband feel like a customer of this experience too.

[00:59:36] Tiffany Sauder: So anything

[00:59:37] Kelly Hiller: you'd hoped that we talked about Kelly, that we haven't? I don't think so. This has been extremely helpful and like some of the thing, like I said, some things just feel like so obvious, like, why haven't I done this before? I think it, it would've really relieved some tensions even going into the travel.

[00:59:54] Kelly Hiller: I think there's things I can do now that like particularly show my husband like, Hey, these are the steps that I'm taking and the things I'm getting in place to make this easier will automatically relieve some of those tensions of like, how in the world are we gonna do this?

[01:00:09] Tiffany Sauder: Yeah. And like it's a work stream.

[01:00:11] Tiffany Sauder: Just like at work. Yeah. So there is an example in my life. My oldest daughter is a junior in high school, and I'm like, she needs to go to college. I have no idea how to get a kid to college. You know, I don't know. It's steps, but I don't know. And she and I are gonna process very differently this whole thing.

[01:00:26] Tiffany Sauder: And so we, we have a meeting every other week to manage this work stream. I'm like, it's a work stream. This is a complex problem. Mm-hmm. Get a kid to college. She's got SAT stuff she needs to do. We need to schedule on-campus visits. We need to go through like asking chat GPT, if this is what your brain can do, what kind of jobs might you be good.

[01:00:45] Tiffany Sauder: And so this forcing function of meeting every two weeks and managing the work stream is again, I think something we're not good at in our family lives. And so you and your husband being like, this is a monster thing that's coming. How do we have a business meeting together every week or every five, whatever your cadence needs to be.

[01:01:03] Tiffany Sauder: Mm-hmm. So that when this comes, we both feel prepared. And there isn't this like two hour like. Dump session where, you know, like, which he would be very overwhelmed by, well, we all would. Yeah. You've been solving silently for the last month and he has exactly 120 minutes to get up to speed. Yeah. Yeah. That wouldn't be, that would not be a positive.

[01:01:24] Tiffany Sauder: So like just meeting on it consistently. Mm-hmm. So that you're moving through the process together and he feels like he's informing it would be another thing I might recommend. So, yeah, for sure.

[01:01:37] Kelly Hiller: No, this was extremely helpful.

[01:01:39] Tiffany Sauder: It's exactly what I was hoping to get out of it. Good. I'm so glad. Well, I'm here.

[01:01:43] Tiffany Sauder: I'm an email away if we need anything. We don't need to do the next one on the microphone. You guys, thank you so much for listening in on this. Kelly. You're so brave. The first thing to creating change is to acknowledge where I'm at is not gonna work. Mm-hmm. And in some ways, this I think could end up being such a blessing to your family.

[01:02:00] Tiffany Sauder: 'cause it's a forcing function to pay attention to. What are we doing? Because this is not gonna sustain with me out of it. So I'm hopeful that this, what you guys put in just blesses your family going forward. And this is all about what the Life of And is. How do you solve for what you want without compromising your values and who you are.

[01:02:17] Tiffany Sauder: Thanks, Kelly. Thank you so much.

[01:02:18] Kelly Hiller: You're welcome. I, I feel, I just feel like a, a weight has been lifted off my shoulders.

[01:02:24] Tiffany Sauder: Oh my word. Amazing. Well, quit of waiting,

[01:02:26] Kelly Hiller: talking about it.

[01:02:28] Tiffany Sauder: That's right. Can practice in your car on to and from work. So, okay, everybody, thanks so much for listening. If you have. Enjoy this episode.

[01:02:36] Tiffany Sauder: Please share it with somebody. It's the fastest way that we grow the show. Thanks for joining us. See you next week. Thanks for listening to the Life of And this is your weekly reminder to keep making bold choices, saying clear yeses and holding space for what matters most. As always, if you like this episode, I'd love for you to drop a review and share it with your friend.

[01:02:56] Tiffany Sauder: It's the fastest way that we can grow the show. Thanks for joining us. I'll see you next time.